Curse

Crom The Pale · Nov 30, 2006, 07:14 PM // 19:14

Zen Disciple

Armor : 80
Health : 480
Energy : 20 +1 regen
Weapon : Quarter Staff - melee range damage 5-15 attack speed 1.2seconds

Attributes:

• Meditation (Primary) for every 3 points in this attribute you gain 1energy and 3health for evading or blocking attacks.
• Quarter Staff
• Insight
• Runic Symbols

Meditation Skills : These would be mostly all stances used to evade or block attacks. Rather than timed stances like a war or ranger these would be based on the number of attacks you could block or evade. ie. 12 points in this attribute and a stance would block the next 8 attack skills.(elite?) Combination of adrenaline, energy(mostly) and signets

Quarter Staff Skills : These would be mostly low damage skills that included knockdowns or caused dazed/cripple. Elite attacks here would knock down multiple adjacent foes. Mostly adrenaline skills and some energy attacks

Insight : These skills would allow the Zen Disciple to create a field around himself and any adjacent allies. While in the field his allies would gain one of the following, health regeneration, energy, blocking, evading,interupt avoidence, speed, armor or increased attack damage. Only one field could be created at a time. These would last for set numbers rather than time and would fail if you left the adjacent range. ie. Ally gains 1..5 arrows of energy regen, max energy gain 5..25. High energy cost + some signets for self energy gain/management.

Runic Symbols : These skills would create an aura around the Zen Disciple that would affect him, his adjacent allies or his foes. Only one aura could be used at a time. These would reduce damage from magical attacks, increase magical damage dealt, reverse damage dealt to him/adjacent allies, slow attack speed of foes, cause interupts or cause health/energy degeneration to adjacent foes. High energy cost + some signets for knockdowns/light damage

This is meant to be a purely support class that can take a lot of damage while buffing his allies in close proximity. Some of his skills would be for any ally/foe in adjacent range others would only affect one target/ally.

Meditation stances would need to be used to regain most energy and some health, a balance of them and the buffing skills would make this char an excellent support class as it can stand in the front line with a war and boost him or stand in the back with casters and protect them.

For the look of this char I was thinking that he/she would have tattoos covering there upper body and use a sleaveless vest. To activate the auras/fields would require them to touch one of the tattoos which would then start to glow. They could were loose pants with combat style boots, maybe.
Its assumed they gain armor protection form the tattoos much like a monk or necromancer.

The armor lvl seems a bit high at first but keep in mind this char deals very little damage and mostly his buffs only affect allies not himself.

Still there is always balance adjustments to be made. Here are some sample skills. Note I did not list any of them as Elite skills but some of them might fit in as they are powerfull.

Meditation

Basic Stance : 5e 15sec recharge - the next 0..5 attacks have a 50% chance of being blocked and you gain 0..3 energy for each one not block
Advanced Stance : 6adren 15sec recharge - the next 0..5 attack skills have a 50% chance of being evaded and you gain 0..3 for each one not evaded.
Elite Stance : 10adren 20sec recharge - the next 0..10 attack skills have a 75% chance of being evaded and you gain 0..5 energy for each attack skill that hits.
Practice Signet : 1sec 30sec - gain 0..10 energy for each equiped stance
Inner peace : stance 4adren - you gain +0..4 energy regen untill you recieve dmg or use a skill.
Crane stance : 5e 15sec recharge - the next 0..3 times you should be knocked down you are not and you gain 0..5 energy each time.
Cobra stance : 8adren - the next attack skill against you is blocked and you steel 0..10 energy from your attacker.
Healing Thoughts : Stance 10adren - if you are suffering from a condition you gain 0..6 arrows of heal regen untill you use a skill.

Quarter Staff

Leg Sweep : QS attack 8addren - target is knocked down
Knee Tap : QS attack 5energy 1sec 15sec - target is crippled for 0..7 seconds
Toe Spike : QS attack 4addren - if target is attacking, target is knocked down
Hand Poke : QS attack 5energy 1/2sec 5sec - if target is attacking, target is interupted
Chin Sweep : QS attack 10addren - If target is casting a spell his action is interupted and target is dazed for 0..6 seconds
Paddle Swing : 10energy 1sec 15sec - all adjacent foes are struck twice, any foes attacking are interupted

Insight

Energy Field : 15energy 1sec 30seconds - Create an energy field around yourself and any allies adjacent to you. Allies in the field gain 0..4 arrows of energy regen. Max energy gained cannot exceed 5..20
Defencive Field : 10energy 1sec 30sec - Allies in the field have the next 0..5attack skills targeting them blocked
Healing Field : 10energy 2sec 20sec - Allies in the field recieve 5..30health each second, maximume health gained 30..120
Guiding Field : 10e 1sec 20sec - For any allies in the field there next 0..5 attacks cannot be blocked or evaded.
Quickining Field : 15e 1sec 30sec - For any ally in the field there attack speed is increased by 25% for 0..30seconds
Power Field : 15e 2sec 30sec - any ally in the field deals +5..15damage with there next 1..10 attacks.
Swift Field : 5e 1sec 10sec - anyone in the field has there movement speed increased by 25% for 1..15seconds
Concentration Field : 15e 1sec 30sec - the next 1..5 skills used by allies in the field cannot be interupted.
United Stance : 10e 2sec 45sec - all allies in the field gain 5..30 armor for 5..30 seconds.
Wisdom Signet : 1sec 60sec - Gain 0..5energy for each Insight skill equiped

Runic Symbols

Ethereal Aura : 15e 2sec 45sec - Create an Ethereal Aura around yourself and any adjacent allies. Allies within the aura recieve 10..50% less damage from magical attacks. This aura lasts for 2..15seconds.
Flaming Aura : 15e 2sec 45sec - Allies within the aura have there fire attribute raised by 0..3 for there next 0..3 spells
Divine Aura : 15e 2sec 45sec - Allies within the aura have there Divine Favour attribute rased by 0..3 for there next 0..3 spells
Encouraging Aura : 10e 2sec 45sec - Allies within the aura gain 50% more addrenalin when they gain addren for 5..15seconds
Reflective Aura : 15e 2sec 60sec - The next 1..3 spells targeting anyone in the aura fail and the caster recieves 10..100 damage
Density Aura : 10energy 2sec 30sec - Any foes in the aura have there attack speed reduced by 25% for 5..15 seconds
Draining Aura : 15e 2sec 30sec - Any foes within the aura lost 0..3 energy every second. Maximum loss of energy 10..30
Painfull Aura : 15e 2sec 45sec - Any foes within the aura suffer 1..6 health degen for 5..15 seconds
Screaming Aura : 15e 2sec 60sec - Any foes within the aura have there next 1..6skills interupted

I hope this lays out the balancing act needed to keep auras/fields up and energy gaining stances.

Cid · Nov 30, 2006, 10:53 PM // 22:53

The armour value is too high. Especially since its primary attribute is not being hit. And, for wearing tattoos/baggy cloth, having the same level of armour as a WARRIOR is just... Needless to say its just not happening

The Runic symbols is a nice idea though

rabbitXcore · Dec 01, 2006, 12:18 AM // 00:18

this class would be alot of fun but i'd like to see some skills before i pass judgement.

Crom The Pale · Dec 03, 2006, 06:34 AM // 06:34

added skills.

Note this is a melee char, hence the war lvl armor, and his auras/fields rarely benifit him only his allies. As for it being the equal of say knights armor with just tatoo's, think armor of earth, its magic!

XosirisX · Dec 04, 2006, 09:21 AM // 09:21

melee chars dun need high armor..look at dervish and assasin. give it 70 armor

Crom The Pale · Dec 04, 2006, 01:47 PM // 13:47

Unlike the war this armor doesnt have the +20 vs physlical and unlike both of them he doesnt have a great healind skill. While he does have lots of evade/blocking he is very vulnerable to magic and interupts. I think this warnents the 80 armor.

draxynnic · Dec 06, 2006, 05:41 AM // 05:41

Balance-wise, it looks like you've made the energy sacrifice for 80 armour. Realism-wise... well, I tend to think that all high-level armour is magically reinforced anyway. Advantage goes to the magically reinforced steel over the magically reinforced skin ;-). While the Paragon does have base 80 armour, at least the armour they wear looks to at least be the equivalent of Glads.

In other words, having someone without armour with an AL matching a Warrior, even superficially, stretches the suspension of disbelief. A better plan might be to start with 70, and some other bonuses (inherent extra vs physical or elemental like the Warrior and Ranger respectively, or extra hit points like the Dervish) to beef up the defense. And rather than citing lack of good healing skills to justify AL80 from a balance perspective, just give the profession a decent healing skill already

.

I'm not sure just how the mechanics mesh with Zen, but I could be showing my ignorance here.

Leg Sweep, Energy Field, Defensive Field and Reflective Aura should probably all be Elite, and there are a quite few others (Crane Stance, Paddle Swing, Quickening Field, Encouraging Aura, Draining Aura and Screaming Aura) that I'm not so sure about but are also approaching that level.

Crom The Pale · Dec 06, 2006, 07:38 PM // 19:38

The way I figued out the armor was that his chest armor would have a -1 energy regen, ALL chars start out with 2 arrows and gain more with armor, this would represent his ability to focus internal energy to shield himself with the runic tattoos.

As for those skills being elite, yes I have not listed any of them as elite simply because only one Aura and one Field can be used at a time. So limiting him to just one in his skill bar seemed a little to harsh. As for the quarter staff attacks and the stance yes they could be made elite.

Another thing to keep in mind is that this is a tank. Its purpose is to protect and buff the other proffesions there by drawing lots of attacks. If i gave him too much in the way of self healing he would come off as a 80 armor monk. His lack of self heals forces him to depend on other chars for healing just as they would depend on him for protection and buffs.

As for mods for the armor, insignias, I was thinking along the lines of +1 energy for each ally affected by a field or aura. While this has the potential to increase his max energy by a large amount it also leaves the whole party tightly packed and open for aoe dmg. Dervishes and Elementalist would have a field day with this!

nebojats · Dec 06, 2006, 10:28 PM // 22:28

I'm wondering, why would anyone attack this character? He only becomes effective when he's dodging/blocking attacks, because that allows him to maintain energy. Without being attacked, he's less of a threat than pre-existing characters (quarter staff does hardly any damage, and 20 energy means he can't be very effective at buffing/debuffing). On top of all that he has a ton of armor, which means it would be nearly impossible to kill him even if I wanted to.

If I were playing against the zen, I'd just save him for last after killing all his teammates. In the meantime, he'd be an annoyance, but nothing more; he wouldn't do much damage and wouldn't be a very effective spellcaster.

Can you convince me otherwise?

P.S. The meditation stances are a completely coincidental homage to my Shrift's Masochism attribute, I see.

Crom The Pale · Dec 07, 2006, 08:04 AM // 08:04

I do love a challenge!

Fist this is my caster buff build.

Skills: Basic Stance
Inner peace
Practice Signet
Toe Spike
Healing Field
Ethereal Aura
Flaming Aura
Res Signet

Ok the Zen Disciple starts out with a monk on one side and a fire elementalist on the other side.

Use Basic stance - cost 5e - average points in attribute gives me 3 chances to block.

Cast Healing Field - cost 10e - average points for 20hp heal every sec for 20sec

Use Practice signet - gain 12energy - 2 stances 6 energy each.

Cast Flaming Aura - cost 15e - max points for +3 to my fire ele.

by now even with just 1 arrow of regen the Zen Disciple should be at about 6-8energy. If you attack I use basic stance then build addren and energy for either Ethereal Aura or I use Toe Spike to knock you down.

If you don't attack me, and I can attack you I build addren for Inner peace then cast Flaming Aura again.

My Elementalist is packing Glyph of Elemental Power and Searing Flames. He is attacking your party with 21 attributes in fire! Thats equivilent to a lvl 28 boss attack!

Second Build - War buffer

Skills : Basic Stance
Inner peace
Knee Tap
Chin Sweep
Swift Field
United Stance
Screaming Aura
Res Signet

So ive got a war and an assasin with me this time.

Cast Swift field

We attack a called target.

Knee tap to cripple
Screaming Aura to interupt your next 2 skills
Practice signet for energy
United Stance to boost our armor by 25points
And after building some addren I either hit you with Chin Sweep, if your casting your now dazed for 4seconds, or I use inner peace then recast Screaming Aura.
Recast Swift Field to pursue and repeat as needed.

This class is built for team work, without it the Zen Disciple would be pretty much useless. While he doesnt cause lots of dmg he does increase the damage output of his allies much like Order of Pain for necros. He also can boost armor and heal them.

One last clarification on his armor lvl.

War armor level is 116 vs physical and 96 vs elemental for basic armor + shield
Paragon is 96 armor with basic armor + shield
Ranger armor is 100 vs elemental dmg

Zen Disciple armor is 80 vs everything.

I honestly think this is the right armor lvl for his role in the game, but the only true way to find out would be ingame testing!

As for meditation I actually got it from a deffinition of Zen.

Zen : A Buddhist sect developed in India and Japan, It differs from other Buddhist sects in seeking the truth through introspection and intuition.

Introspection is achived through meditation.

I think your Shrift's Masochism was a little to creative for me to pull meditation out of it.

nebojats · Dec 09, 2006, 11:31 PM // 23:31

Alright, awesome response. I now see why I would want to kill the Disciple very quickly. He's a master of buffing and if he's not taken out real quickly, my opponents will decimate me with their improved stats. Thanks for helping me visualize how he'd work in battle. I'm impressed with the class concept. I guess I have a few critiques/questions:

1) Why would anyone use the Paragon ever again? I don't know that class really well, but from what I can tell from your description, I'd much rather have a Disciple than a Paragon in my group. The Disciple just seems like an overall more effective buffer, plus he has some decent offensive skills that target enemies as well.

2) I love the idea of a guy who can go into a sort of trance and build up energy and health again without aid from anyone else. I think the skills you have listed for regaining energy are too overpowered though. I mean, your caster buff build without any support could in the middle of battle completely replentish his health and energy in a matter of seconds (Inner Peace and Healing Field alone are insanely powerful, forget all the other skills).

3) Maybe the armor is good, but I feel like this character should be as weak as they come. Otherwise he could just stand there and get wailed on while buffing his allies. His buffs are so amazingly powerful that he shouldn't be able to maintain them for too long.

4) Just a general question: How do you kill this guy? His armor is pretty damn good, he buffs himself and allies like nobody else in the game (as a monk, I can positively say that Healing Field is completely and utterly jaw-dropping. inner peace is definitely unequaled). If I manage to get through one of his blocks (which he converts to energy and uses to buff himself), he can still take tons of damage. You laid out examples of this guy being a beast in battle above. Now can you lay down some examples of him getting his ass kicked handily?

Crom The Pale · Dec 10, 2006, 03:42 AM // 03:42

Glad too

Fist his fields and auras take 2 seconds to cast and are easy for any mesmer to interupt.
Second he only buffs adjacent allies and this means Paragons still have a good place on the battle field.
Third because his buffs are adjacent a meteor shower would interupt him and deal heavy damage.
His armor does nothing agains holy dmg of a smiter or vamp/shadow dmg of a necromancer.

As for his healing and energy management, yes its a little overpowered. I think some of his skills MUST be made into Elites, im just not sure wich ones would give him a good balance.

Another thing to do would be to force him apart from those he intends to buff. If you drop a firestorm on him while he is using a buff vs physical attacks or use a dervish when hes buffing for magical attacks you would likely force either him or those adjacent to him to retreat.
If they move off cripling or slowing him with a hex to keep them apart would buy you time to kill those he was protecting.

In the end a Mesmer would truely be the bane of this char, with mabye the exception of him taking a secondary proff that could help with the interupts. ie: glyph of essence/sacrifice or mantra of resolve.

A war with penitrating axe attacks should deal out nice dmg and be able to disable his skills, assuming not every attack can be blocked.

If you know exactly what your facing you could build your skills to make this a very effective char, but with limitations to who you can buff effectively.

A balance skill bar for this char would need some real thought behind it I believe and a lot of practise with our team to perfect playing together with this class.

Hope that sounds as fun to you as it does to me!

And thanks for the feed back!

Any ideas of new skills that would fit in here?